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I'm afraid this almost spoiled the reading experience for me before I even started:

We’ll talk about what’s going on with you and Roberts currently,

Roberts? Obviously he means Robert Holmes. Tsk. And he uses Robert's name correctly in the previous paragraph, so no excuse. Bad proof-reader! Bad!

He originally was going to be a professor, a sort of paranormal research Indiana Jones.

That would make GK a very different (and very interesting) game. Arizona Smith and the Empire of the Golden Fibula! OK, nothing as obviously derivative as that, but ...

Yes, Kickstarter is obviously not the way to go when it comes to creating games. Look at what happened to other former Sierra staff who wanted to create games through Kickstarter. But it sucks that Activision promised Jane and then bailed out. Ironclad contracts are so important.

Jane can write a novel in 3-4 months? Well, it depends on the length, the approach (pantsing vs. outlining vs. both), and what she means by "novel". Does she mean 0th-draft? 1st-draft (i.e. critiqued novel)? 2nd-draft (i.e. one that's passed through an editor?) Inquiring minds want to know!

I don't understand either why Microsoft or Activision acquired the IP to GK, if they don't want to do anything with it. Why have the rights to something if you're not going to use it?

Rath Darkblade wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 5:36 pm Yes, Kickstarter is obviously not the way to go when it comes to creating games. Look at what happened to other former Sierra staff who wanted to create games through Kickstarter. But it sucks that Activision promised Jane and then bailed out. Ironclad contracts are so important.
Jane can write a novel in 3-4 months? Well, it depends on the length, the approach (pantsing vs. outlining vs. both), and what she means by "novel". Does she mean 0th-draft? 1st-draft (i.e. critiqued novel)? 2nd-draft (i.e. one that's passed through an editor?) Inquiring minds want to know!
I don't understand either why Microsoft or Activision acquired the IP to GK, if they don't want to do anything with it. Why have the rights to something if you're not going to use it?

For Kickstarter, it can be hit or miss. The LSL:Reloaded, did fine. There was drama with the person behind it (not Al Lowe, but the other person - but that's gone and done). The Hero-U one suffered from finances, but now seems to be doing fine. The Pinkerton Road one did fine, created a game (well, two really) out of it. SpaceVenture, well, that's... been quite the ordeal.
But plenty of others have released games successfully.
I, myself, am done with Kickstarters. I did the Sierra-related ones, and a few others, that all were successful. But the ordeal of it all, is so lengthy - and it NEVER EVER meets the deadline. Ever. Not a single one I've backed. They've always been off by at least - AT LEAST - one year. As for Jane, I believe this is what she does these days. She has pen name for other books that she writes that are not under "Jane Jensen" - so her ability to write a book in 30 days seems very plausible to me.
As for GK and the IP rights, it's because they acquire the "entire catalog" - and may not even be aware of all it. They may want ONE thing out of the catalog, but as a part of the deal, they need to buy all of it. So for example if they wanted GAME_A's IP, but whomever owns it - owns GAME_B through GAME_Z also; and says "You need to pay X amount more because we're selling you these additional IPs that you care nothing about. It's all or nothing to get it off our plate."

Rath Darkblade wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 5:36 pm I don't understand either why Microsoft or Activision acquired the IP to GK, if they don't want to do anything with it. Why have the rights to something if you're not going to use it?

Part of it probably has to do with corporate inertia. NPR has a podcast where they try to buy the rights to a totally irrelevant Marvel character: Doorman. Marvel wouldn't do it. One thing they mention is that you just don't know if a character might suddenly be used in such a way that suddenly makes it very popular, like in the Groot example they mention. So Activision just might want to use the GK IP some day. Another problem is that what happens if someone misuses the IP, i.e does something offensive with it. People might associate this with the original IP holder. The original IP holder then has to go on the defensive saying they are not responsible because they no longer hold the IP, but it would still generate bad press. And decisions like this probably have to go through several layers of management and lawyers which is time consuming and costly, so in the end its simply cheaper and easier to say "no".

notbobsmith wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 12:14 am

Rath Darkblade wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 5:36 pm I don't understand either why Microsoft or Activision acquired the IP to GK, if they don't want to do anything with it. Why have the rights to something if you're not going to use it?

Part of it probably has to do with corporate inertia. NPR has a podcast where they try to buy the rights to a totally irrelevant Marvel character: Doorman. Marvel wouldn't do it. One thing they mention is that you just don't know if a character might suddenly be used in such a way that suddenly makes it very popular, like in the Groot example they mention.

They could have mentioned HALF the cast of Guardians of the Galaxy.
Star Lord was a COMPLETE unknown. He had only really appeared in Marvel magazines, not really Marvel Comics mainstream.
Groot appeared in like... 1960? And pretty much never after that.
Rocket Racoon appeared in Hulk and had a 4 issue limited series. Until the movie, you could have bought his first appearance in the dollar bin.

Now?

Each of those comics fetch an insane price.
On Average LOW GRADE copies (because it was 1960s and seemingly insignificant, no one took care of comics back then) - the average price for a very, very, very low grade copy is about $2,000 to $3,000 dollars for Groot's first appearance (in https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R ... 3&_sacat=0 for example).

While Rocket's goes for about $200 to $500 (depending on the grade) for a comic that was a magazine also out in 1976 (I believe it was?) - for example: https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R ... &_osacat=0

High end copies of Star Lord's first appearance (same magazine line as Rocket) fetches between $700 and $1000 (for example - https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R ... &_osacat=0) - again, 1976.

Prior to the movie?

Each $1 bin pick ups.

Tawmis wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 6:37 pm

Rath Darkblade wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 5:36 pm Yes, Kickstarter is obviously not the way to go when it comes to creating games. Look at what happened to other former Sierra staff who wanted to create games through Kickstarter. But it sucks that Activision promised Jane and then bailed out. Ironclad contracts are so important.
Jane can write a novel in 3-4 months? Well, it depends on the length, the approach (pantsing vs. outlining vs. both), and what she means by "novel". Does she mean 0th-draft? 1st-draft (i.e. critiqued novel)? 2nd-draft (i.e. one that's passed through an editor?) Inquiring minds want to know!
I don't understand either why Microsoft or Activision acquired the IP to GK, if they don't want to do anything with it. Why have the rights to something if you're not going to use it?

For Kickstarter, it can be hit or miss. The LSL:Reloaded, did fine. There was drama with the person behind it (not Al Lowe, but the other person - but that's gone and done). The Hero-U one suffered from finances, but now seems to be doing fine. The Pinkerton Road one did fine, created a game (well, two really) out of it. SpaceVenture, well, that's... been quite the ordeal.
But plenty of others have released games successfully.
I, myself, am done with Kickstarters. I did the Sierra-related ones, and a few others, that all were successful. But the ordeal of it all, is so lengthy - and it NEVER EVER meets the deadline. Ever. Not a single one I've backed. They've always been off by at least - AT LEAST - one year.

Hmm. I haven't tried the Pinkerton Road games or the SpaceVenture games. Are they good? (Asks he who played Sierra games to death)

Kickstarters seem to suffer from lack of finances, lack of managerial experience, lack of accounting experience, or all three. (At least, that's how it seems to me). Does that sound right to you?

Tawmis wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 6:37 pm As for Jane, I believe this is what she does these days. She has pen name for other books that she writes that are not under "Jane Jensen" - so her ability to write a book in 30 days seems very plausible to me.

Hmm. *thinks* Do you mean that Jane can write a book in 30 days, or that she can publish one in that time?

Writing a book in 30 days is no biggie. There are competitions to do it. Google "write a book in 30 days competition" and you'll find millions of results. But publishing a book in 30 days is hard, unless you already made your name in other ways (as Jane has).

notbobsmith wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 12:14 am

Rath Darkblade wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 5:36 pm I don't understand either why Microsoft or Activision acquired the IP to GK, if they don't want to do anything with it. Why have the rights to something if you're not going to use it?

Part of it probably has to do with corporate inertia. NPR has a podcast where they try to buy the rights to a totally irrelevant Marvel character: Doorman. Marvel wouldn't do it. One thing they mention is that you just don't know if a character might suddenly be used in such a way that suddenly makes it very popular, like in the Groot example they mention. So Activision just might want to use the GK IP some day. Another problem is that what happens if someone misuses the IP, i.e does something offensive with it. People might associate this with the original IP holder. The original IP holder then has to go on the defensive saying they are not responsible because they no longer hold the IP, but it would still generate bad press. And decisions like this probably have to go through several layers of management and lawyers which is time consuming and costly, so in the end its simply cheaper and easier to say "no".

I like the phrase "corporate inertia". It reminds me of Sir Humphrey's Creative Inertia system for rejecting unwanted proposals (first seen in "Yes Minister", back in ... *checks* 1982?!) But not much changes...

To adapt it to "Corporate Inertia", here's how it might go:

Stage Zero: Underling approaches overling with a proposal from an outsider (e.g. Jane Jensen).

Underling: Sir, Mrs Holmes wishes to purchase the Gabriel Knight IP again.

In Stage One, Overling's reply is: "I am not familiar with that IP. Don't bother me now. I have many other things on my plate to deal with."

The Stage Two reply: "It sounds like an interesting proposal. Perhaps we should listen to it. But is this the right way? Perhaps we should offer her the entire IP range we have."
Underling: Wouldn't that drive her away?
Overling: Precisely.

Stage Three: "This is not the right time." And if the Overling's boss asks why, there are all kinds of excuses:
- End of Financial Year is coming up, we need to close the books for the auditors.
- End of Month is coming up, we need to close the books for the auditors.
- We're approaching [insert holiday here], and we want to close the books before then.
- It's only the start of the calendar year. This can wait.
- Etc.

If Jane persists past Stage Three, we move on to Stage Four: "The proposal has run into all kinds of difficulties." Which ones? Financial, problems with the Board, legal. Either one of these can be made completely incomprehensible and take ages. Legal problems are the best for being made incomprehensible.

Let's say that Jane persists, and solves all these problems ... which is when the Overling moves to Stage Five: "We're having a stakeholders meeting soon, so I really can't focus on this right now. Let me delegate this to [Mr/Mrs/Miss XYZ], who is our [Miscellaneous Manager]."

Of course, Mr/Mrs/Miss XYZ knows nothing about it, which is where they move to Stage One again.

Does that sound about right, NBS?

Rath Darkblade wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 3:39 am Hmm. I haven't tried the Pinkerton Road games or the SpaceVenture games. Are they good? (Asks he who played Sierra games to death)

GRAY MATTER was good, as far as I played. MOEBIUS, I barely started and got side tracked by something else. Both of those were Jane's game. SpaceVenture, to me, is absolutely amazing and fun (despite the bugs in the game, that they're still working on - game has been released, but they're still trying to get rid of some bugs they have).

Rath Darkblade wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 3:39 am Kickstarters seem to suffer from lack of finances, lack of managerial experience, lack of accounting experience, or all three. (At least, that's how it seems to me). Does that sound right to you?

Yes, the eyes are hungrier than the stomach, is what I always say.

Rath Darkblade wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 3:39 am Writing a book in 30 days is no biggie. There are competitions to do it. Google "write a book in 30 days competition" and you'll find millions of results. But publishing a book in 30 days is hard, unless you already made your name in other ways (as Jane has).

Oh, I frequently partake in one of them - though, come 2020, and everything with the wife's health that's stopped.
https://nanowrimo.org/participants/tawmis

I will say - writing a novel in 30 days, is not easy. From my own experience. Even before my life was turned upside down.
Whether it was just other things in life (going out with significant other, family, friends; running errands; writer's block; spending time with friends and family; etc) - knocking out a novel in 30 days is not easy. Or it wasn't for me. And I consider myself really good at being able to write. (For example, those character backgrounds I do - I am about to release my 10th book of that - and each of those is at least 50 pages - so I've written 500 pages of background stories) - but still, knocking out the goal of a book in 30 days is crazy difficult.

Ah, yes- NanoWriMo. (I forgot the name of it).

True, it's not easy. It also depends on if you pants it or outline it, how experienced you are, how complex it is, how much time you can dedicate to it, and so on.

I couldn't write a book in 30 days, since I try to plan it well in advance and get it critiqued. But pantsing a story in 30 days ... hmm. Also, how long is the book? I've pantsed an 8,000-word short story in several days, but they're probably thinking of something longer.

Rath Darkblade wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 4:49 am Ah, yes- NanoWriMo. (I forgot the name of it).
True, it's not easy. It also depends on if you pants it or outline it, how experienced you are, how complex it is, how much time you can dedicate to it, and so on.
I couldn't write a book in 30 days, since I try to plan it well in advance and get it critiqued. But pantsing a story in 30 days ... hmm. Also, how long is the book? I've pantsed an 8,000-word short story in several days, but they're probably thinking of something longer.

Well, for NanoWriMo - the whole point is "first draft" - write to write and worry about consistency and other things in your next draft. And even then it's a challenge. The newly designed site doesn't have the old stuff - I think (it says in the link) - but I've been a member since 2003? 2013? Something - and managed to only break the 50,000 mark - ONCE. And it took foregoing my sanity (what little is left)

Ah... yes, 50K words is a challenge. That's 2,000 words a day (or thereabouts) ... and 2,000 words is roughly half-a-chapter.

It can be done. But as I said, it depends on how much time you can give it. 50K words is complicated.

Then again, I wrote a 90K story once ... over the course of a year. (Was getting it critiqued). Writing is tough!

So, because I write a lot in my spare time, I just love Jenna Moreci's channel. And since writing is tough, this is hilarious: 10 Things You Should Never Say to a Writer.

But I also found this too: My Book was Pirated on Amazon. This is both educational ... and incredibly scary.

(Fair warning: this channel includes fairly common swear-words. Anyone who's offended by that? Well ... don't click the links? OTOH, if you don't mind swear-words, enjoy! Go nuts!)